Gyro behaviour when doing Funnel - Experts give your view

[edmond22]

Hey all,

One of my observations on my 2 heli in recent months led me to this interesting question. I will start by listing down the heli first:

First Heli:
Nitro RJX 50 with SK360 flybarless
Spartan with BLS251 (gain 70%) with metal plate

Second Heli:
Trex 600 ESP
Spartan with 9256 (gain 70%) no metal plate, just cushion


Observed behaviour:

The trex flies great with good tail control. Funnel feels normal needing some left rudder in a anti clockwise tail down fashion.

The RJX flies great too with good tail control. However, when doing the same funnel as mentioned earlier, I need very little (touch) to get the rudder in place. In fact, before I switch to metal plate mounting and reconfig, the tail will even piro left on its own slightly whenever in funnel that I need to correct by inputing some right rudder instead . Although it doesn't do that anymore, it felt strange to input so little feed to the rudder when doing funnel. Also when doing high speed backward loop, it does sometimes throw tail slowly piro to the left when the heli is at the top of the loop (inverted). A higher gain seems to help.



----------------------------------------------------

Now people, give me your opinions. Is this a case of too little gain or too much? Or Vibration or flybarless queer? Only recently I started flying the trex 600 did I notice such a big diff in the feel between the 2 heli.

[johndyl]

ed, ur trex behavior sounds pretty normal..

but ur rjx one sounds abit off. have u tried resetting up the tail? or maybe u are sub-consciously doing a pirofunnel

[Murdanny]

Hey all,

One of my observations on my 2 heli in recent months led me to this interesting question. I will start by listing down the heli first:

First Heli:
Nitro RJX 50 with SK360 flybarless
Spartan with BLS251 (gain 70%) with metal plate

Second Heli:
Trex 600 ESP
Spartan with 9256 (gain 70%) no metal plate, just cushion


Observed behaviour:

The trex flies great with good tail control. Funnel feels normal needing some left rudder in a anti clockwise tail down fashion.

The RJX flies great too with good tail control. However, when doing the same funnel as mentioned earlier, I need very little (touch) to get the rudder in place. In fact, before I switch to metal plate mounting and reconfig, the tail will even piro left on its own slightly whenever in funnel that I need to correct by inputing some right rudder instead . Although it doesn't do that anymore, it felt strange to input so little feed to the rudder when doing funnel. Also when doing high speed backward loop, it does sometimes throw tail slowly piro to the left when the heli is at the top of the loop (inverted). A higher gain seems to help.



----------------------------------------------------

Now people, give me your opinions. Is this a case of too little gain or too much? Or Vibration or flybarless queer? Only recently I started flying the trex 600 did I notice such a big diff in the feel between the 2 heli.

Bro Ed,

I think your RJX needs a mechanical readjustment to compensate the tail from piro-ing to the left.

Im quite suprised to know that your gain is so high on both of your machines. Im using less than 50% on 611 with Logictech servo, Spartan with 9251 and 611 with 9256 combo. It doesnt hunt?

[edmond22]

John, it is true lol, I can show one of these days. It used to be fine but for some reason of the late, it is exhibiting this behaviour. At first I thought it was the servo wearing out or something.

Danny,

I did a reset before. Here is 1 more thing I forgot to mention. If I reset it in such a way that it is not mechanically center for the slider but centered with 7-8 deg pitch as suggested by Spartan, it does feel quite alright. If I centered it mechanically slider meaning zero pitch, this queer behaviour is there.

For the gain part, it is 51 and above for HH mode. So it is only about 40%.

[Murdanny]

John, it is true lol, I can show one of these days. It used to be fine but for some reason of the late, it is exhibiting this behaviour. At first I thought it was the servo wearing out or something.

Danny,

I did a reset before. Here is 1 more thing I forgot to mention. If I reset it in such a way that it is not mechanically center for the slider but centered with 7-8 deg pitch as suggested by Spartan, it does feel quite alright. If I centered it mechanically slider meaning zero pitch, this queer behaviour is there.

For the gain part, it is 51 and above for HH mode. So it is only about 40%.

Understood about the gain. Not a problem.

Some manufacturer already preset center of your tail arm slider (90 degrees) giving pitch to your tail blades. Im not sure abt the RJX but this is the closest but its yet to be fine tuned to your gyro and servo combination. So you know where you tail direction needs to be corrected, you turn your link in or out.

[kenkoh]

Bro,

Ask Alloy lah !! He is our 'TAIL KING' now!!! GY611, Spartan, Gy401, Mini-G, 9256, 9257, bls251, MKS-DS8910.. all he know liao.. he is the expert lah

[Ghostfit]

Bro Ed,

I think your RJX needs a mechanical readjustment to compensate the tail from piro-ing to the left.

Im quite suprised to know that your gain is so high on both of your machines. Im using less than 50% on 611 with Logictech servo, Spartan with 9251 and 611 with 9256 combo. It doesnt hunt?

But you got a super duper Futaba G911 implanted in your left thumb !

We're mere mortals, you know !

[Serpent]

Hey all,

One of my observations on my 2 heli in recent months led me to this interesting question. I will start by listing down the heli first:

First Heli:
Nitro RJX 50 with SK360 flybarless
Spartan with BLS251 (gain 70%) with metal plate

Second Heli:
Trex 600 ESP
Spartan with 9256 (gain 70%) no metal plate, just cushion


Observed behaviour:

The trex flies great with good tail control. Funnel feels normal needing some left rudder in a anti clockwise tail down fashion.

The RJX flies great too with good tail control. However, when doing the same funnel as mentioned earlier, I need very little (touch) to get the rudder in place. In fact, before I switch to metal plate mounting and reconfig, the tail will even piro left on its own slightly whenever in funnel that I need to correct by inputing some right rudder instead . Although it doesn't do that anymore, it felt strange to input so little feed to the rudder when doing funnel. Also when doing high speed backward loop, it does sometimes throw tail slowly piro to the left when the heli is at the top of the loop (inverted). A higher gain seems to help.




----------------------------------------------------

Now people, give me your opinions. Is this a case of too little gain or too much? Or Vibration or flybarless queer? Only recently I started flying the trex 600 did I notice such a big diff in the feel between the 2 heli.

Ed,

Is your correction on the tail excessive when executing the funnel ?
I think minor correction is ok. Actually I do constantly make minor adjustments of the rudder stick when doing the funnel. I guess every pilot has his preference of how much HH gain he likes to fly with.
I typically have my gain set , say on a 611 , around 36%.

[edmond22]

Ed,

Is your correction on the tail excessive when executing the funnel ?
I think minor correction is ok. Actually I do constantly make minor adjustments of the rudder stick when doing the funnel. I guess every pilot has his preference of how much HH gain he likes to fly with.
I typically have my gain set , say on a 611 , around 36%.

Where is Mr Alloy, he is supposed to advise.

The tail correction is not excessive, the corrections I make I think is fine within limits. The only thing I am not comfortable with is when I do not need to make any corrections (the tail holds down on its own) and even at times moving ahead of the funnel. I personally think the Trex 600 feels just right for me. The RJX one needs more research, I dun need to do any crazy right rudder correction now executing a anti clockwise tail down funnel but it is still extremely strange to just slightly touch it to the left for holding a funnel. It is strange, it does not seem to exhibit much of this behaviour in a normal flight turn and inverted backward flight (yes! I am doing it liao lol) seems quite ok too. This is why I am wondering if it is a flybarless queer.

[Serpent]

Where is Mr Alloy, he is supposed to advise.

inverted backward flight (yes! I am doing it liao lol) seems quite ok too. This is why I am wondering if it is a flybarless queer.

Alloy is probably "busy at work" right this moment... at BBFC..hehe.

Cool and cheers on your reverse flight man

I will probably fly the T600N tomorrow evening at JB. You coming ?

[baby_zyklon]

Bro Ed,

I think your RJX needs a mechanical readjustment to compensate the tail from piro-ing to the left.

Im quite suprised to know that your gain is so high on both of your machines. Im using less than 50% on 611 with Logictech servo, Spartan with 9251 and 611 with 9256 combo. It doesnt hunt?

You are using the logitech 6100 servo with the 611? Any weird behaviour? Works perfectly fine?

[Murdanny]

You are using the logitech 6100 servo with the 611? Any weird behaviour? Works perfectly fine?

Very well. No weird behaviour at all. Had more than 100 flights on it and looking good.

[jaZallo]

me got no problem on what ever gyro me use when doing the funnel.

the only big problem is looking for the gyro after the funnel.

enjoy.

[Serpent]

me got no problem on what ever gyro me use when doing the funnel.

the only big problem is looking for the gyro after the funnel.

enjoy.

You mean the gyro flew out after the funnel ?

[jaZallo]

You mean the gyro flew out after the funnel ?

after crash da.

enjoy.