What Lipo battery to use, please advise...

[Tanbenson]

Hi Guys,

I have brought a some item listed below for my EDF plane construction. Just need your good advise on a suitable lipo battery to be use without causing any damages to the battery and electronics and motor. Plane gross weight at 800g. Trying on a modified SU-27 with single EDF power.

1. 1X GWS 75mm EDF with 4 blades fan.
2. EX1157 Brushless motor from Rotor
Weight 60G , RPM/v 4800, Max Amps 20a.
3. Lipo 11.1v 1600mHA 3S1P, 12C rating ( Current using for other plane. )
3. Towerpro 30A ESC.
4. Hitec 6Ch RX.
5. 3X micro-servos.

Any advise ?
Thanks in advance.

Best Regards
TanBenson

[ER69]

Hi Guys,

I have brought a some item listed below for my EDF plane construction. Just need your good advise on a suitable lipo battery to be use without causing any damages to the battery and electronics and motor. Plane gross weight at 800g. Trying on a modified SU-27 with single EDF power.

1. 1X GWS 75mm EDF with 4 blades fan.
2. EX1157 Brushless motor from Rotor
Weight 60G , RPM/v 4800, Max Amps 20a.
3. Lipo 11.1v 1600mHA 3S1P, 12C rating ( Current using for other plane. )
3. Towerpro 30A ESC.
4. Hitec 6Ch RX.
5. 3X micro-servos.

Any advise ?
Thanks in advance.

Best Regards
TanBenson

Hi Benson,
Did you test the max amp draw of the motor on load ? (with DF ) coz 20A look a bit low for a 4800kv motor on a 75mm DF.

If lets say its drawing 20A max, Your batt(12c) might be just right to use, you wont be flying at max all the time right?

[ER69]

One more thing to take note benson, for your 800g SU, you will need at least 280watts to push it. let say your motor is drawing 20A on the 75mm DF, its only giving 222watts. Well, with this kind of power, it can still fly, but will be very exciting in windy days..
Now, come to the ducting,to prevent any turbulance inside the ducting, Make sure you round off all sharp edges on the duct intake, for smoother air flow, glass the inner ducting with a thin layer of resin, if you have a exhuast outlet duct, reduce not more than 12% at the end.

[Tanbenson]

Lipo battery for EDF 75mm.

Thanks ER69. for the kind advises .Will try to reduce the weight further if possible. My SU will be quiet different from the original SU. May reduces the fuelage weight and increase the wing surface area so to reduce the load of the motor and battery. My EDF is around 70mm at the front tip and around 60mm at the end with around 120mm cone length in-betwwn. Hope can get it flying by next week, now trying to reinforce the cockpit area with balsa wood to keep the electronic and battery from harm in the event of nose-diving.

Thank you again.

Best Regards
TanBenson

[ER69]

Thanks ER69. for the kind advises .Will try to reduce the weight further if possible. My SU will be quiet different from the original SU. May reduces the fuelage weight and increase the wing surface area so to reduce the load of the motor and battery. My EDF is around 70mm at the front tip and around 60mm at the end with around 120mm cone length in-betwwn. Hope can get it flying by next week, now trying to reinforce the cockpit area with balsa wood to keep the electronic and battery from harm in the event of nose-diving.

Thank you again.

Best Regards
TanBenson

Cool..
Do post some pics once completed on the show your Jets thread.
Happy building

[Tanbenson]

Current draw too high......

Tested with Emeter- seem that at full throttle the BL motor draw about 40a, kind of high.
Will need a Speed 400 motor fro the 75mm EDF's fan. Seem that the BL motor can take the draw for a few seconds though.
Wander if Align BL Motor 400LF -2800kv is good enough or higher kv for the EDF, having more toque to spin the 4X blades but need to modify the fan adaptor for the Align.
The Align shaft is 3.17mm but the adaptor is 2mm.
Anyone any idea where to purchase the fan adaptor of dia 3.17mm for GWS EDF 75mm FAN adaptor?

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards
TanBenson

[ER69]

Tested with Emeter- seem that at full throttle the BL motor draw about 40a, kind of high.
Will need a Speed 400 motor fro the 75mm EDF's fan. Seem that the BL motor can take the draw for a few seconds though.
Wander if Align BL Motor 400LF -2800kv is good enough or higher kv for the EDF, having more toque to spin the 4X blades but need to modify the fan adaptor for the Align.
The Align shaft is 3.17mm but the adaptor is 2mm.
Anyone any idea where to purchase the fan adaptor of dia 3.17mm for GWS EDF 75mm FAN adaptor?

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards
TanBenson

Well, i can say that the amp draw of the motor around 40+A on that size of fan is quite normal. For EDF set,it will be better if use a higer kv motor.
For this size of fan, I would recon that you use at least 3200KV or above 400/480 BL motor on it, however, be prepare to use a higher amp ESC and batts.

[zennith]

Align BL Motor 400LF -2800kv is good enough or higher kv for the EDF, having more toque to spin the 4X blades.The Align shaft is 3.17mm but the adaptor is 2mm.

Benson, you can try jethobby he got several types of adaptor. I got some from him and also some of my motor got to drill even on the adaptor bcos of motor shaft sizes.

I understand GWS EDF 75mm FAN unit is running by 370 or 380 motors. I try on high power 4 cells and 3 cells. The fan flew off from the unit... highmax motor 4500kv. So just beware...Danger on eyes no spares on tat.

Align motor have a tendency of heating up at high RPM, as the motor casing is alloy for heat dissipation and reall v hot- is for heli and pusher plane. Since you are buying a good motor to use, go for a MEGA or at least WARP motor. Amp draw at 35 to 40 too..

ER use both of them.

Zennith - EDF flyer

[ER69]

Align BL Motor 400LF -2800kv is good enough or higher kv for the EDF, having more toque to spin the 4X blades.The Align shaft is 3.17mm but the adaptor is 2mm.

Benson, you can try jethobby he got several types of adaptor. I got some from him and also some of my motor got to drill even on the adaptor bcos of motor shaft sizes.

I understand GWS EDF 75mm FAN unit is running by 370 or 380 motors. I try on high power 4 cells and 3 cells. The fan flew off from the unit... highmax motor 4500kv. So just beware...Danger on eyes no spares on tat.

Align motor have a tendency of heating up at high RPM, as the motor casing is alloy for heat dissipation and reall v hot- is for heli and pusher plane. Since you are buying a good motor to use, go for a MEGA or at least WARP motor. Amp draw at 35 to 40 too..

ER use both of them.

Zennith - EDF flyer

Hi Zennith,
You are rite man..
Well, During the early days, I had tried all kinds of motors and ducted fan units for testing.
The Align motor is not really suitable for using in DF unit.

Hi ben,
As for the GWS fan, due to the shaft got no locking nut to sercure the fan , so when using higher KV or so called more "powerful" set up, either the fan blades might flex or the whole fan might fly out.
If let say you just wan a normal perforamce on your plane which weight around 500g, the GWS's you got is good enough.
End of the day, to have a good set up of EDF, a few factors for choosing the right power plant which you must take into consideration.
1. Weight of plane?
2. Watts needed to push it.
3. Wat kind of flying style you wan? (Mild , areobatics or high performance)

[Tanbenson]

Now.... Why is my ESC so warm...?

Hi Guys,

Thank you for your responses on my pass enquires, now that I have purchase a " no brand " dia 65mm EDF which look like a WeMoTec clone with 5 carbon blades. My configuration is this:
1. Dia 65mm EDF
2. Align BLM-400 BL motor 2800kv from my Trex.
3. Towerpro 30A ESC
4. 11.1V 1600mAH 12C battery 128grams.

With the above configuration- I did a dry-run test.The result is:
1. EDF fan is able to generate thrust, with throttle at 100% from the TX, but not sure about the force of the thrust.
2. The ESC is very warm after 5sec at full throttle at the TX.Seem to draw more that 30A.
3. The battery is not warm during the 5sec test.

With your expertise, need your advise on my ESC and others. Seem that my ESC need to upgrades to higher A.?
Is the motor not suitable for the task ,as it rated max at 25Amp for the manufacture's spec.
Also, seem that the EDF 's blades adaptor is too heavy for the motor to handle?
How to reduces the POWER draw for the motor via ESC? Or I have to purchase a 60A ESC to be on the save side.
After checking through the EDF forums, seem that EDF required high A for the ESC to fly a same mass.
Thank you in advance.

Best Regards
Tanbenson

[zennith]

Esc getting hot

Hi Tanbenson

You have purcahse the fan unit (5 blades like wemotec ). I suggest jus hold for a while B4 you do flight test. I am concern abt the amp draw..

Do you have a amphere meter (multimeter) do a check? From the battey terminal if is a dinn connector you will need some skill to connect it , else use get a multimeter with a amp testing in sim lim (abt$100). ** do not and do and pls do not short terminals**

Check the current draws. If bad.. then your battery will eventually suffer in flight (ur ground test only 5 sec not enough, i do in minutes- stopwatch).

Mess of blade X Amp draw (Power) = torque. The fan unit I got is the same you bought, it require more power motor like hacker, warp, MEGA to perfom. Why... the mess of the blade is heavy. Req more amp draw to produce trust by turning blades n generate trust.

Me and my friend - both had experimenting alot of diff motors , tat even calculation of spec, fans of blades, perfomance (output trust- on a weighting machine, amp draw, fan blades pitches, batt, ESC, and charting graphs etc. All sort of funny experiment including plane shape and weights.

Algin that you use (documented notes by us is Motor Align BL400S 2.5KV brushless with unit Fan 62-63 mm 6 bladed from MTH HOBBY PRODUCTS INDUSTRIAL CO, LTD is about 8 amp draw trust 12 OZ 3 lipo cell 1800). So low right??!! yes.. flight test done and motor only warm, esc and battery not even warn - cold like never use. Full Trottle flight done all the way 5 mins through out same result.

Suggest..Do the same set up you get a great result.

Lots of hard work , calcultion and plenty full time and try all types of fan units you will get result- no short cut. I am experimenting n recording brush motor 280, 300, 350, 370, 400 on diff fan units too...

May the duct (ducted fan) force be with U

Zennith

[zennith]

Here is the Science and education, If not bore than read

http://www.micapeak.com/bike/FJR1300/misc/torque-power.html

Nothing too loose something to gain. Positivie thinking

zennith

[Tanbenson]

Hi Zennith,

Thank you for your advise. Very much grateful for your kind words.

As you mention in the advise, seem that the Current Draw is cause by the weight of the blades and blade adpator, right?
By the way , where can I find the MTH HOBBY PRODUCTS in SG?
Appreciate if you can shade some lights. Thank you

Algin that you use (documented notes by us is Motor Align BL400S 2.5KV brushless with unit Fan 62-63 mm 6 bladed from MTH HOBBY PRODUCTS INDUSTRIAL CO, LTD is about 8 amp draw trust 12 OZ 3 lipo cell 1800). So low right??!! yes.. flight test done and motor only warm, esc and battery not even warn - cold like never use. Full Trottle flight done all the way 5 mins through out same result.

Best Regards
TanBenson

[ER69]

Hi Guys,

Thank you for your responses on my pass enquires, now that I have purchase a " no brand " dia 65mm EDF which look like a WeMoTec clone with 5 carbon blades. My configuration is this:
1. Dia 65mm EDF
2. Align BLM-400 BL motor 2800kv from my Trex.
3. Towerpro 30A ESC
4. 11.1V 1600mAH 12C battery 128grams.

With the above configuration- I did a dry-run test.The result is:
1. EDF fan is able to generate thrust, with throttle at 100% from the TX, but not sure about the force of the thrust.
2. The ESC is very warm after 5sec at full throttle at the TX.Seem to draw more that 30A.
3. The battery is not warm during the 5sec test.

With your expertise, need your advise on my ESC and others. Seem that my ESC need to upgrades to higher A.?
Is the motor not suitable for the task ,as it rated max at 25Amp for the manufacture's spec.
Also, seem that the EDF 's blades adaptor is too heavy for the motor to handle?
How to reduces the POWER draw for the motor via ESC? Or I have to purchase a 60A ESC to be on the save side.
After checking through the EDF forums, seem that EDF required high A for the ESC to fly a same mass.
Thank you in advance.

Best Regards
Tanbenson

Hi Tanbenson,
Since you dont have a amp meter and not sure about the amp draw.
If you can try, test it for abit longer like 15~20 second at all Full throttle.
coz most of the ESC will have the surge funtion of maybe 10 ~ 20 seconds on giving out higer amp which stated for the ESC.
Therefore, if your motor is drawing more the 30A and within the surge limit, it will not cut during the 5second test. (btw is your motor hot?)
How many batt are you using?
If let say your motor is drawing 30A, your batt will be very hot or ESC will even cut during the test.
You can reduce the power draw by reducing the End piont for the throttle on you TX.
Well, dont guess your amp draw, check it to make sure your set up is right.
If not, it will either shorten your batt's life span or worst still, throttle cut in midair..

[Tanbenson]

How about this Align motor?

Thanks you Zennith and E69 for your advise, much appreciated. Another question......

How about this replace my existing motor with this Align for my CLONE WeMoTec EDF fan.
Hopefully, will reduce the Power Draw below 30A. What do you think?

430L Brushless Motor(3550KV) RCM-BL430L

Thank you.

Best Regards
TanBenson