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    #16
    Originally posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Thanks for everyone's comments. We the majority of the flyers who fly safely should educate and help the newbies to fly safe so that they can enjoy the hobby too. But we should also enforce safe flying to protect life, property against the the errant few. It only takes one unfortunately.

    Happy safe flying
    I agree. Thanks Hawkeye for the constant reminders. We need it time to time. It can be fustrating sometimes. The end result is always RC have less place to fly and people get hurt, resulting in unpleasant situation. Got kena reply with a power phrase : "This is public place, I fly my plane, not happy, call police or see MP lah."

    Sometimes say so much also in the end fall on deaf ears so I pack up and leave the field.:mad3:
    Hanger
    Hirobo XRB SR Lama
    Hirobo Quark SRB
    Hirobo Quark SRB SG
    Eflite Blade SR (For Display)
    Blade450 3D
    MSH Mini Protos (SOLD)
    COMPASS 6HV (Combat Fit PES A)

    Plane
    Dynam PBY Catalina 1.4m
    FMS J3 Cub 1.4m
    Artech F14 Tomcat EDF
    HK FLYJET EDF
    Artech Skyfun
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    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by elmosan View Post
      some EDF is so slow, I got so many examples..., heli flight envelope is so wide that it can fly in more envelope that planes are capable. Can turn tighter, fly faster than EDF, loop tighter, and more. I dont know but my experience is heli is damn fast in FFF, I tagged my 600 sized bird at 176kmhr.
      Your heli is nothing compare some SG flyer I got to know, who says EDF is slower, I have seen SG flyers flying EDF easily over 200km/h, you have never seen one does not mean there is none.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFDec6uRRbQ

      Comment


        #18
        Clarification

        Originally posted by Slamdunk View Post
        Your heli is nothing compare some SG flyer I got to know, who says EDF is slower, I have seen SG flyers flying EDF easily over 200km/h, you have never seen one does not mean there is none.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFDec6uRRbQ
        Hi Bro,

        My comment is "some EDF fly slower". Since he said Heli cant compare with EDFs(All EDF?)
        This was in response to a comment that Heli and Planes dont mix well since according to the comment, the bro stated that RC terms heli cannot join planes since EDF fly faster and have flight envelope that dont match heli. Also, the point I disagree is that he is saying cannot fly any planes since EDF fastest and no planes can compare?

        Maybe my heli is nothing as suggested by u. Yep, I agree also. Even a rubbish nothing heli can pass the 100kmhr as easy as ABC, time to focus on topic alr.

        So according to him, I cannot fly my glider alr, or eStarter alr once EDF is in the air, since is different envelope with EDF? Main arguement is being speed?


        Maybe got 1 EDF going to invented that FLY sound barrier. But never change my point
        1. THere are slow EDF planes around
        2. Comparing Speed is not very wise in this safety thread.

        I think if main arguement is speed, it is potentially dangerous. I think need to be situational awareness can proper procedures as highlighted by TS bro Hawkeye. THe main issue is how to have a fun fly and at the end of day safe, as stated in the title of thread.
        Hanger
        Hirobo XRB SR Lama
        Hirobo Quark SRB
        Hirobo Quark SRB SG
        Eflite Blade SR (For Display)
        Blade450 3D
        MSH Mini Protos (SOLD)
        COMPASS 6HV (Combat Fit PES A)

        Plane
        Dynam PBY Catalina 1.4m
        FMS J3 Cub 1.4m
        Artech F14 Tomcat EDF
        HK FLYJET EDF
        Artech Skyfun
        Dynam P51D Mustang
        Parkzone P51

        Tx:
        Futaba 6J 2.4GHz(SOLD)
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        DX8
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        Comment


          #19
          I was a witness to 1 of his crash many years ago. Man, that wasn't pleasant.

          Originally posted by pixeldixel View Post
          Spoken like a man who experienced 2 mid-airs in 2 weeks with his planes that were each barely 2 weeks old.

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by $h@d0w View Post
            I was a witness to 1 of his crash many years ago. Man, that wasn't pleasant.
            Can elaborate what happened?
            Human error? other factors like incliment weather? equipment failure?

            It is a possible learning case study...

            Its like AIR CRASH INVESTIGATION.... my favourite SCV programme...
            Hanger
            Hirobo XRB SR Lama
            Hirobo Quark SRB
            Hirobo Quark SRB SG
            Eflite Blade SR (For Display)
            Blade450 3D
            MSH Mini Protos (SOLD)
            COMPASS 6HV (Combat Fit PES A)

            Plane
            Dynam PBY Catalina 1.4m
            FMS J3 Cub 1.4m
            Artech F14 Tomcat EDF
            HK FLYJET EDF
            Artech Skyfun
            Dynam P51D Mustang
            Parkzone P51

            Tx:
            Futaba 6J 2.4GHz(SOLD)
            Spektrum DX6i
            DX8
            Futaba 9CAP

            Comment


              #21
              Guys, let's not turn this into a pissing contest. Topic is how to fly safely. If the guys at the filed can agree, it should be 10 mins for the slow planes, 10 mins for the fast planes. Everyone takes turns to enjoy the field and airspace. Is that too much to ask? I hope not. Let's share the space.
              Do you feel the RUSH....!!!!

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by Hawkeye View Post
                Guys, let's not turn this into a pissing contest. Topic is how to fly safely. If the guys at the filed can agree, it should be 10 mins for the slow planes, 10 mins for the fast planes. Everyone takes turns to enjoy the field and airspace. Is that too much to ask? I hope not. Let's share the space.

                Yeah, agreed, plus 10mins for the heli, observe the basic courtesy and safety is paramount.

                The field is not ours, so fly safe cos I fly heli but get really uncomfortable if a quad or heli fly too close to the crowd, is no longer about how good ur flying skill are but are u 100% sure electronics won't fail u n result u crashing the crowd.

                Comment


                  #23
                  While we all aim for some standards for safety, just as an observation, I think it's fair not to go overboard and give the skewed impression that this hobby is overly dangerous. So maybe we have to moderate, slightly, discussions like this which are seen by the general public unfamiliar with RC.

                  To put things into perspective, actually the hobby is already quite safe as compared to other activities which have recorded fatalities, e.g. football, running, golfing (lightning risk!), fishing, cycling, field hockey (just read that a player died being struck by ball...), and many, many others. And do we see a general outcry from the public, or authorities trying to clamp down on these things?? So while we try to be safe, also must not over-react. Let's have some opinions?
                  ------------------------------
                  Airworthy: FMS Mini Trojan, Cloudsfly, BF-109 Funfighter, HK Mini Stick, Flasher 450 Pro, Mini Titan v2, E-Flite Blade MCPx.
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                  Comment


                    #24
                    Fox Kilo,

                    Running....its you and the elements. You crap out is your own risk you take. Ifyou go on a running track most people run inthe same direction anyway...except for sum. Collisions are easiy avoided as you are where you are and you react accordingly.
                    Hockey and Soccer.....set in a confined controlled area. normally away from traffic but not bystanders
                    Golf...ony for the rich and famous and in controlled areas and even the driving range has nets...and even than you take turns at each hole. If you ever drive by Upper Thomson ROad just before AMK Ave 1......I have seen golf balls bounce on the road barely missing cars.

                    Think about RC flying.....

                    Its not in a controlled area. Normally near traffic and passer by. Your plane travels in larger envelopes than soccer balls, golf balls and hockey balls as the energy is retained due to the electric motor. If you do the math......a soccer ball is about 500grams...maybe heavier and being kicked at close range probably travels at about 40-50km/hr or even faster. Say 10 m/s....0.5 x 0.5kg x10m/s^2 is about 25kg(m/s)^2 worth of kinetic energy. The difference is that a soccer ball loses energy as it travels thru the air due to drag. So standing further away is a wise thing to mitigate injury.

                    A RC plane, say a faomy is about 500 grams too travels at about the same speed...10m/s...it too has a simllar amount of energy. But that energy stay with it as long as the prop stays on. If you get hit by it, it will be almost like getting punched. Plus a spinning prop that cuts makes for a lethal weapon.

                    I think being paranoid makes the sport safe....being complacent is being dangerous.
                    Do you feel the RUSH....!!!!

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Think this thread was based on observations at the flying site, not comparing the hobby to other activities. football, running, golf, etc tend to be pretty safe for spectators and often undertaken in obvious venues for such activities. Models are dangerous, especially when flown in public spaces, by inexperienced/irresponsible/stupid people. If you think otherwise, there is something wrong with your thinking, a football to the side of the head i would bet is far less problematic than a pusher doing 60mph with a pointy front end.

                      There is definitely a lack of safety consciousness amongst flyers, certainly not all, but judging by what i have seen lately, this is no longer the fringe element, rather becoming quickly, the majority as the hobby becomes more accessible. Exacerbating this is modellers turning to public venues, rather than clubs when they start. Choosing to listen to people on forums (who may or often is the case, have no idea what they are talking about) for advice, rather than to what tend to be fairly experienced modellers at clubs with established and tested protocols. By doing this, the basics tend not to be properly learnt, not to say anything about flying etiquete. What is also lost is club communities, which build up over time and promote the long term sustainability of the hobby, as is the case in more developed modeling jurisdictions. But i digress..

                      Rather than downplaying the risk, Hawkeye is proactively trying to educate, which is commendable.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Elmo san...

                        I have all togther racked up 5 mid air crashes...

                        Crash # 1... I was flying my normal oval circuits...My beloved Raketenwurm 2B #1.....when I did my climb.....on power and hit my freinds plane from behind.....My plane lost control and crashed on the road....it happens. I compensated the other guy by giving him my flying wing Bullit. Now I only fly my hotliner when the airspace is empty. So I wait for all to land or wait my turn.

                        Crash #2....Pylon racing with my buddy.....mid air collision on a turn going at 130km.hr...both planes disintergrated spectacularly and some components landed on the pavement and jumped across the road. The motor missed 2 passer by only a few meters. And they were sitting 150m from us. Shake hands and go oh well.....

                        Crash #3.....was flying my buddies EDF plane....and I bumped another guy...both if us flying tight circuits....it was a mid air but no crash.

                        Crash #4.....Maiden flight of Blaster Dlg when I got rear ended by some bloke flying at the far left of the field flying circuits. Wing cracked...he crashed. Lucky crash in the field....we have no control where something crashes....Could be avoided if the faster plane did wider circuits or avoided the slow planes airspace.

                        Crash #5.... FLying circuits on maiden flight when a DLG pilot standing in the middle of field launches plane and hits my wing. No crashes but damage to my wing tip. Like driving your new car home only to be rammed by a motor bike. The pilot was informed onthe maiden flight and if he had waited for 10 mins for me to complete collision would be avoided. The other flyers around were nice to wait for me.

                        Does not matter who is in the right or wrong...point is planes are flying objects.....and they go where you have no control when a mid air happens. So lets be careful.
                        Do you feel the RUSH....!!!!

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by Hawkeye View Post
                          Elmo san...

                          I have all togther racked up 5 mid air crashes...

                          Crash # 1... I was flying my normal oval circuits...My beloved Raketenwurm 2B #1.....when I did my climb.....on power and hit my freinds plane from behind.....My plane lost control and crashed on the road....it happens. I compensated the other guy by giving him my flying wing Bullit. Now I only fly my hotliner when the airspace is empty. So I wait for all to land or wait my turn.

                          Crash #2....Pylon racing with my buddy.....mid air collision on a turn going at 130km.hr...both planes disintergrated spectacularly and some components landed on the pavement and jumped across the road. The motor missed 2 passer by only a few meters. And they were sitting 150m from us. Shake hands and go oh well.....

                          Crash #3.....was flying my buddies EDF plane....and I bumped another guy...both if us flying tight circuits....it was a mid air but no crash.

                          Crash #4.....Maiden flight of Blaster Dlg when I got rear ended by some bloke flying at the far left of the field flying circuits. Wing cracked...he crashed. Lucky crash in the field....we have no control where something crashes....Could be avoided if the faster plane did wider circuits or avoided the slow planes airspace.

                          Crash #5.... FLying circuits on maiden flight when a DLG pilot standing in the middle of field launches plane and hits my wing. No crashes but damage to my wing tip. Like driving your new car home only to be rammed by a motor bike. The pilot was informed onthe maiden flight and if he had waited for 10 mins for me to complete collision would be avoided. The other flyers around were nice to wait for me.

                          Does not matter who is in the right or wrong...point is planes are flying objects.....and they go where you have no control when a mid air happens. So lets be careful.
                          Thanks hawkeye, it is very kind and generous of you to share your experiences...:cool3:
                          Hanger
                          Hirobo XRB SR Lama
                          Hirobo Quark SRB
                          Hirobo Quark SRB SG
                          Eflite Blade SR (For Display)
                          Blade450 3D
                          MSH Mini Protos (SOLD)
                          COMPASS 6HV (Combat Fit PES A)

                          Plane
                          Dynam PBY Catalina 1.4m
                          FMS J3 Cub 1.4m
                          Artech F14 Tomcat EDF
                          HK FLYJET EDF
                          Artech Skyfun
                          Dynam P51D Mustang
                          Parkzone P51

                          Tx:
                          Futaba 6J 2.4GHz(SOLD)
                          Spektrum DX6i
                          DX8
                          Futaba 9CAP

                          Comment


                            #28
                            I used to fly at a field within walking distance of my house. No problem with crowded skies there cos I and maybe a neighbour or two fly there at same time. Then half the field got chopped off by a housing development.

                            Then I moved to another field within walking distance too. Quiet place, I share with another guy who flies heli. But here it is not possible to rog due to the layout of the field. So, I started looking around for a place where I could practice ROG.

                            Then I found this field where it's big enough to have 2 very distinct groups of fliers, each happily flying, and neither group interfering with the other group due to the large size of the field.

                            Most of the fliers at my end of the field are experienced fliers, with some raw beginners, some intermediate, and so on. Initially, I found safety was more or less heeded by everyone.

                            Everyone goes to the flight line about 20 meters from the road, and fly there. There was a mix of all sorts of planes, gliders, etc, of all sorts of speeds. Generally, planes are flown in the same circuit direction, with a bit of out of circuit flying. That's ok, after all, flying RC is all about having fun.

                            Then we had a flyer who started flying way back, while standing at the side of the road, with his plane flying over the people at the flight line. He could not fly too well, so presumeably, he was not aware of the danger of flying from behind the main flight line. But eventually, I think someone told him about it, and he too flew from the flight line.

                            That impressed me a lot, and I thought, wow, people here take safety seriously. IE, we do not fly RC Planes, Helis, etc, when there are people in front of you, and these people are within the "flight envelope" of the machine you are flying! Hope I made that clear. For those who don't know what I mean, "flight envelope" means the whole area where your flying machine is capable of moving to, in controlled flight. And it is a no-no to fly your machine behind you, where spectators are usually standing.

                            But wait! Before we all get too smug, especially those who have a good guess which field I am referring to, sad to say, consideration for safety has gone totally down the drain lately. Now we have fliers, experienced fliers, not newbies, who think it is perfectly safe to fly from the side of the road, which is "Behind" the flight line where others are flying. Not only that, they think nothing of flying their machines directly over, in front of, and behind the flight line.

                            Recently, I was concentrating on my landing approach, when a screaming edf jet zoomed, or I should say, screamed directly over my head, maybe about 20 feet up, startling me so badly that I almost crashed. I managed to recover, flew a quick, low level circuit and landed immediately.

                            I told the flier concerned about it, and I'm happy to say, he stopped flying from the road side, and joined the flight line.

                            Yet, incomprehensibly, we see so many of the more experienced fliers flying from the side of the road, which is behind the main flight line, with their planes zooming over, behind, and in front of the fliers at the main flight.

                            Ask yourself, why are you setting such bad examples for others to follow? Do you really think it's safe to fly standing behind the main flight line? Sure, it is safe for you, but is it safe for those guys at the flight line? I know, we all think we are expert pilots, but ever heard of mechanical failure? Move an object fast enough, no matter how soft the object is, even foam, and when it hits a human being, it can be lethal.

                            It used to be fun to fly when lots of other fliers are around, and it used to be generally quite safe, but now, I fear for my safety when people start flying from behind me, from the side of the road. Is it really too much of a burden to just take a short walk over to the main flight line, and fly from there? With a hobby like RC, the only things you exercise are your thumbs, why not exercise your legs also? Good for your health, Good for Safety!

                            For me this is the main safety issue I see at the field that I now fly at, although OP has brought up many other valid points too.

                            Unfortunately, we don't really know if the people who are being unsafe read this forum or not, so ends up only those who are already concerned for safety reads these posts.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              noted.

                              this reminds me of this few incidents, lol

                              this guy was flying a bit too close to the flight line

                              so one of us could not take it already and yelled at him

                              "Oy! fly further away la!"

                              and so he complied.

                              Another case was

                              this guy had a case of a badly trimmed pusher jet

                              again, that thing was all over the place and a bit too near the cars and so on

                              so some ppl started shouting

                              "OY! LAND YOUR PLANE! LAND YOUR PLANE!"

                              and so the guy did.

                              I guess the key is to speak up when someone is doing something wrong

                              Communication and respect are factors of safety

                              e.g. inform ppl: I am going to take off soon, can or not

                              I am going to go real fast and fly circuits at mid height

                              Am I clear to take off?

                              and so on.

                              it also is helpful for everyone to gather in the same place and at one common flight line (of course it is better if we all know each other and are friends in the first place)

                              by the way, stunt pilots, read my signature
                              "Always fly with a responsible attitude. You may think that flying low over other people’s heads is proof of your piloting skill; others know better. The real expert does not need to prove himself in such childish ways..." - the Multiplex Build Manual

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Hawkeye View Post
                                Elmo san...

                                I have all togther racked up 5 mid air crashes...

                                Crash # 1... I was flying my normal oval circuits...My beloved Raketenwurm 2B #1.....when I did my climb.....on power and hit my freinds plane from behind.....My plane lost control and crashed on the road....it happens. I compensated the other guy by giving him my flying wing Bullit. Now I only fly my hotliner when the airspace is empty. So I wait for all to land or wait my turn.

                                Crash #2....Pylon racing with my buddy.....mid air collision on a turn going at 130km.hr...both planes disintergrated spectacularly and some components landed on the pavement and jumped across the road. The motor missed 2 passer by only a few meters. And they were sitting 150m from us. Shake hands and go oh well.....

                                Crash #3.....was flying my buddies EDF plane....and I bumped another guy...both if us flying tight circuits....it was a mid air but no crash.

                                Crash #4.....Maiden flight of Blaster Dlg when I got rear ended by some bloke flying at the far left of the field flying circuits. Wing cracked...he crashed. Lucky crash in the field....we have no control where something crashes....Could be avoided if the faster plane did wider circuits or avoided the slow planes airspace.

                                Crash #5.... FLying circuits on maiden flight when a DLG pilot standing in the middle of field launches plane and hits my wing. No crashes but damage to my wing tip. Like driving your new car home only to be rammed by a motor bike. The pilot was informed onthe maiden flight and if he had waited for 10 mins for me to complete collision would be avoided. The other flyers around were nice to wait for me.

                                Does not matter who is in the right or wrong...point is planes are flying objects.....and they go where you have no control when a mid air happens. So lets be careful.
                                Hi , Thanks for sharing.

                                What I am writing maybe likely piss some people off. But I am just being honest.

                                I am considering flying with some regular seasoned flyers. I had been flying on my own on 2 occasions on a deserted field with no one because

                                (A) I am a newbie and don't want to be embarassed when my plane crashes

                                (B) because I had earlier tried to orientate myself with senior flyers at fields, but they too seem cold and unfriendly and unhelpful and gave me a ' WTF are you doing, flying your beginner plane here- look'


                                So I think the OTHER IMPORTANT ETIQUETTE is to also educate all regular and seasoned old-birds RC flyers to spare a thought, stop being rude (you may not know it, but to newbies, you are) to new flyers who come in.

                                I think a friendly casual and soft conversation goes a LONG LONG LONG way to everyone having an enjoyable safe flying time at the site. After all, the site belongs to not just the seasoned regular flyers but also newbies too and we have to start some where. And let;s not forget, you were once newbies and flying erractically too.

                                Don't believe me? I suggest you disguise yourself and go to new flying site where no one knows you, and you start to fly your highway trainer and see what kind of reception and welcome you get from senior regulars who are there.

                                So my message to all seasoned regulars who read this is :

                                (A) don't be incensed if you read this. Because if you are, you just know you are guilty of some of the things I said and experienced above

                                (B) BE HELPFUL. We newbies have to start some where. You too were a newbie before.

                                (C) Being Kind, Courteous GOES A LONG WAY to building up this sport hobby. Shouting and shooting glares at newbies who made mistakes IS NOT EDUCATING, but alienating them.

                                My humble 1c worth.

                                Comment

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